The Golden Compass ... Warning

[legelegel]

Anti God and anti religion movie coming to us on Pearl Harbor Day.

http://www.snopes.com/politics/religion/compass.asp

http://www.goldencompassmovie.com/

[CowboyJD]

I've read the first book of the series (the Golden Compass), and I'm a practicing Catholic. I didn't find the first book so much Anti-God as Anti-organized religion. The author is an avowed atheist who says he wrote the books to expose children to atheistic principles, and I understand that becomes more apparent in the next two books.

I also have read in a number of places that the movie has managed to irritate both atheist activists and Christian because the movie completely softsells the anti-religion theme in the book.

[legelegel]

I've read the first book of the series (the Golden Compass), and I'm a practicing Catholic. I didn't find the first book so much Anti-God as Anti-organized religion. The author is an avowed atheist who says he wrote the books to expose children to atheistic principles, and I understand that becomes more apparent in the next two books.

I also have read in a number of places that the movie has managed to irritate both atheist activists and Christian because the movie completely softsells the anti-religion theme in the book.

Interesting. Not strong enough message for one, but too strong for the other.

Just another wolf in that wool clothing.

[Verb]

I think the trilogy is marvelous. It's outstanding young adult fantasy literature. The only "religion" it is against is the imaginary one in the book--some kind of giant nameless, faceless chuch which has achieved a state of being not unlike Big Brother in 1984.

This is dys-utopian literature--an imagined future in which the beneficial institutions of society have gone bad and become menacing. While it definitely warns against giving too much power to institutions, in no way is it anti-God. That's just internet foolishness.

[CowboyJD]

I think the trilogy is marvelous. It's outstanding young adult fantasy literature. The only "religion" it is against is the imaginary one in the book--some kind of giant nameless, faceless chuch which has achieved a state of being not unlike Big Brother in 1984.

This is dys-utopian literature--an imagined future in which the beneficial institutions of society have gone bad and become menacing. While it definitely warns against giving too much power to institutions, in no way is it anti-God. That's just internet foolishness.

With all due respect, the author would disagree with you. He's been quoted in 2003 saying "My books are about killing God", and in 2001 saying that he was "trying to undermine the basis of Christian belief". I don't think it's a coincidence that the name he uses for the church body (it's not nameless) is The Magisterium is the term that refers the teaching authority of Catholic Church.

I agree that it's very good literature, but I think it's a copout to just say "it's fiction" that doesn't comment at all on the real world. The much of the best fiction in the world is allegorical commentary on the real world....including the book you compared His Dark Materials trilogy to....1984.

[OSUFan]

It's not the first time a movie has given an atheistic or anti-Christian view and it won't be the last. Christ and the gospel can withstand such an attack. Besides, the Bible says things are going to get worse.

I haven't read the book and know nothing about the author but the special effects look kick-ass so I think I will go see it. If I'm not entertained, then I won't go see the sequels.

[Ivan]

I'm still going to see it, cause I love these fantisy type movies.

[CowboyJD]

It's not the first time a movie has given an atheistic or anti-Christian view and it won't be the last. Christ and the gospel can withstand such an attack. Besides, the Bible says things are going to get worse.

I haven't read the book and know nothing about the author but the special effects look kick-ass so I think I will go see it. If I'm not entertained, then I won't go see the sequels.

I agree. I'll being seeing it.

Verb was right, it is a great young adult series. I see nothing wrong with allowing young adults access to thoughts and ideas that may challenge their faith.

I won't be taking my girls because it's PG-13 and they're not there yet. Plus many of the issues and scenes might be a little intense for them still.

[OSUFan]

I see nothing wrong with allowing young adults access to thoughts and ideas that may challenge their faith.

I see nothing wrong with thoughts and ideas that may challenge someone secure or mature in his faith but someone young or someone who is a child faith-wise can be swayed to and fro by different religions or ideologies. That's not healthy or good for the soul, as one might say.

[CowboyJD]

I see nothing wrong with thoughts and ideas that may challenge someone secure or mature in his faith but someone young or someone who is a child faith-wise can be swayed to and fro by different religions or ideologies. That's not healthy or good for the soul, as one might say.

I'd argue that having your faith challenged is how one actually becomes secure and mature in it. Besides, who would be the appropriate person to decide whether someone is secure or mature enough in their faith to deal with such challenges? I'm a big fan of free will and self determination.....it's a fundamental element of my faith.

[Pokes4Life]

I'd argue that having your faith challenged is how one actually becomes secure and mature in it. Besides, who would be the appropriate person to decide whether someone is secure or mature enough in their faith to deal with such challenges? I'm a big fan of free will and self determination.....it's a fundamental element of my faith.


I agree wholeheartedly. I've found that I've grown a lot stronger in my faith because I have asked why. I think a large part of that comes from being an engineer and have a very analytical and scientific mind.

[OSUFan]

I'd argue that having your faith challenged is how one actually becomes secure and mature in it. Besides, who would be the appropriate person to decide whether someone is secure or mature enough in their faith to deal with such challenges? I'm a big fan of free will and self determination.....it's a fundamental element of my faith.

Having your faith challenged by a death in the family or a tragedy which questions "Why could this happen?" or even something as simple as what might be right or wrong to do is one thing. But submitting yourself to ideologies or religions that contradict or deny what you newly believe in is not the way to mature in faith. That kind of maturity comes from further study, worship, understanding and living in your faith.

The "babes" of faith who Paul talks about can be swayed more easily and swaying doesn't necessarily bring about maturity, at least in my opinion.

[CowboyJD]

Having your faith challenged by a death in the family or a tragedy which questions "Why could this happen?" or even something as simple as what might be right or wrong to do is one thing. But submitting yourself to ideologies or religions that contradict or deny what you newly believe in is not the way to mature in faith. That kind of maturity comes from further study, worship, understanding and living in your faith.

The "babes" of faith who Paul talks about can be swayed more easily and swaying doesn't necessarily bring about maturity, at least in my opinion.

Again, who gets to decide who's a babe and who's mature enough to deal with being exposed to outside ideologies or religions? We're probably just going to end up agreeing to disagree, but that sounds more like fear than faith in God to me.

[cactusjack]

I for one won't see it. Just a choice to not give our 20 bucks to someone who is out to attack christianity. I'm sure the hate is subtle, but there.
I know thats over reacting to some, but its my little part.

[OSUFan]

Again, who gets to decide who's a babe and who's mature enough to deal with being exposed to outside ideologies or religions? We're probably just going to end up agreeing to disagree, but that sounds more like fear than faith in God to me.

CowboyJD, it's very difficult to sum this up in a neat little paragraph. There are many factors in maturity including the exposure to other ideologies and religions. To answer your question, hopefully it is the person being exposed who gets to decide if he/she is mature enough. I lean more to growing and learning about one's faith before tackling other ideologies or religions as a basis of seeing how strong one's faith is. There's a gray area in there and whole hell of a lot of factors involved in this discussion, I know. I just wanted to point out that my preference for maturity involves digging deeper into what you believe. Making it personal. Sucking up all the knowledge you can through study, worship, prayer, etc. and then... if you want or you have to challenge that faith... you can because your foundation is solid.

[CowboyJD]

CowboyJD, it's very difficult to sum this up in a neat little paragraph. There are many factors in maturity including the exposure to other ideologies and religions. To answer your question, hopefully it is the person being exposed who gets to decide if he/she is mature enough. I lean more to growing and learning about one's faith before tackling other ideologies or religions as a basis of seeing how strong one's faith is. There's a gray area in there and whole hell of a lot of factors involved in this discussion, I know. I just wanted to point out that my preference for maturity involves digging deeper into what you believe. Making it personal. Sucking up all the knowledge you can through study, worship, prayer, etc. and then... if you want or you have to challenge that faith... you can because your foundation is solid.

You summed it up very well in a neat little paragraph. What you say here makes alot of sense, and I do understand more what you meant now, thanks.

[osujane]

I for one won't see it. Just a choice to not give our 20 bucks to someone who is out to attack christianity. I'm sure the hate is subtle, but there.
I know thats over reacting to some, but its my little part.

I feel the same way. :)

[OSUFan]

Has anyone gone to the movie? I heard one review from a friend and it was only lukewarm. I think I will pass on seeing it. Maybe rental, maybe.

[Ivan]

From what I hear it was not very good. Which sucks, because I love those kind of movies.

[kpoke]

I for one won't see it. Just a choice to not give our 20 bucks to someone who is out to attack christianity. I'm sure the hate is subtle, but there.
I know thats over reacting to some, but its my little part.

I agree. Won't be donating my $ to the cause of an admitted atheist. I saw him interviewd on one of the morning news shows (don't remember which one) and the things he had to say just sent chills down my spine.

[panhandler62]

It's on our "when it hits the disk" list.

I disagree about the exposure to other ideas being a bad thing. It seems to me that a "mature faith" based on a narrow focus on a specific dogma is more akin to indoctrination than it is to spiritual growth.

It seems to me that if my faith in the Lord is lessened by listening to what others think of by learning what others know then it is probably not faith in the Lord, but faith in what someone else says about the Lord, that I am actually losing.

To quote a movie that had some possitive comment on the Lord and less than possitive comment on some forms of practiced Christianity; "Why would God make us all so different if he wanted us to be the same?"

We're all just guessing anyway, so we should probably try to give each other a break. :)

[Verb]

It's on our "when it hits the disk" list.

I disagree about the exposure to other ideas being a bad thing. It seems to me that a "mature faith" based on a narrow focus on a specific dogma is more akin to indoctrination than it is to spiritual growth.

It seems to me that if my faith in the Lord is lessened by listening to what others think of by learning what others know then it is probably not faith in the Lord, but faith in what someone else says about the Lord, that I am actually losing.

To quote a movie that had some possitive comment on the Lord and less than possitive comment on some forms of practiced Christianity; "Why would God make us all so different if he wanted us to be the same?"

We're all just guessing anyway, so we should probably try to give each other a break. :)

That was thoughtfully and beautifully said, and I agree completely.

(Haven't seen the movie yet, but I intend to.)

[OSUFan]

[QUOTE=panhandler62;2821]To quote a movie that had some possitive comment on the Lord and less than possitive comment on some forms of practiced Christianity; "Why would God make us all so different if he wanted us to be the same?"QUOTE]

Interesting quote. I personally think God made us all different so we all could use our unique abilities, talents and spiritual gift to build up the body of Christ. I'm not sure He wants all the same unless you are talking about us all being believers in Christ.

What movie was this quote from?

[wickerbill]

How does an atheist kill God if he doesn't believe in God?

[osutuba]

I for one won't see it. Just a choice to not give our 20 bucks to someone who is out to attack christianity. I'm sure the hate is subtle, but there.
I know thats over reacting to some, but its my little part.
I'm with you, jack. Even though it looks impressive, I won't go see it, especially since I have read reports that the author considers his books the antithesis of the Narnia series and is quoted as saying he hates C.S. Lewis with a passion. I may change my decision once a few people here have seen it. Even then, it won't be until it hits DVD

[panhandler62]

Interesting quote. I personally think God made us all different so we all could use our unique abilities, talents and spiritual gift to build up the body of Christ. I'm not sure He wants all the same unless you are talking about us all being believers in Christ.

What movie was this quote from?

The quote is from the movie Saved (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0332375/). Saved takes a satirical stab at the over-zealousness of some Christian schools without invoking some kind of overall distaste for Christianity.

We all have to find the road we can walk but I think it's important to stop and ask ourselves, from time to time, if we are walking in the footsteps of our Lord or if we are just trying to fit in with others. Jesus didn't love the lost sheep less than the found sheep and his commandment to us was to love each other as he loved us, not to love those who are easiest to love the most.

Should Christianity fall by the way because there are examples of fierce indoctrination and abuse by (some of) the church? Of course not, but I think it is valuable to see what other perspectives may be. If the church of our Lord looks like David Koresh's compound to the unsaved; instead of being angry at their complaint we might, perhaps, better serve the Lord in asking why or how "we" have made his message of universal love unappealing.

[SUPERMAN]

A quote I love and agree with as a christian:

"The greatest single cause of atheism in the world today
Is Christians who acknowledge Jesus with their lips
Then walk out the door and deny him by their lifestyle.
That is what an unbelieving world simply finds unbelievable."